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sidmis

Question

Every time I seek information, I add the following line at the bottom.

 

During the Inspection I am intending to take photographs of Records, Documents, Objects that I am allowed to Inspect.

 

Invariably the PIOs [CPIO/SPIO] deny the same saying that taking photographs is not allowed in the Act.

 

So what is position? Any members of this forum ever used camera to take photographs during file inspection?

 

Any feedback/suggestion/decisions which may help me?

 

Sidharth

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sandeepbaheti

From the thread we can reasonably conclude that photography would be allowed. Regarding the fees, since nothing is specified in the Rules, no separate fee can be charged for photography. Only normal fee for inspection can be charged.

Needless to mention, you will have to make your own arrangements for photography, entirely at your cost.

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Sanjeev,

 

As per the following order of IC AD, in a case involving our member sidmis (please refer to: http://www.rtiindia.org/forum/7537-taking-photographs-during-inspection.html?highlight=photography+inspection), photography is allowed during inspection.

 

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/AD-23022009-06.pdf

The Commission invokes Section 2(j) (iv) of the RTI Act to allow use of camera by the Appellant to take photos of documents required. Accordingly, the CPIO is directed to provide all the information as requested by the Appellant in his RTI request dt. 18.8.08 and also allow the use of photographic camera for taking photographs of records in the file which the BSNL had agreed to show to the Appellant.

 

Sec 2(j)(iv) reads:

 

2.j.iv) obtaining information in the form of diskettes, floppies, tapes, video cassettes or in any other electronic mode or through printouts where such information is stored in a computer or in any other device;

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Sidmis,

 

Your Second Appeal decided in your favour:

 

IC(AD) has said the same thing that I said in post #5 above - Sec 2(j)(iv) allows the use of still and video cameras during inspection:

 

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/AD-23022009-06.pdf

 

The Commission invokes Section 2(j) (iv) of the RTI Act to allow use of camera by the Appellant to take photos of documents required. Accordingly, the CPIO is directed to provide all the information as requested by the Appellant in his RTI request dt. 18.8.08 and also allow the use of photographic camera for taking photographs of records in the file which the BSNL had agreed to show to the Appellant. The information to be provided within 15 days of the receipt of this Order.

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colnrkurup

I have never experienced any problem. Whenever I go for inspection I go with my digital camera and has been taking photograph of documents whenever I need. When someone crib, I used to say that 'Then let us sort it out first with your Head of Office" showing Section 2(j)(iv). So far the matter has been ending there. Even in cases where I seek prior permission to photograph no one has been replying that aspect.

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SomeGuy

While taking inspection of a file or records under section 2(j)(i), it would be quite convenient to carry a (digital) camera or even a portable scanner along to take quick photographs (or scans) of documents in case your requirements are limited to un-certified copies. In my one attempt to do so (in the courts, not under RTI), I was refused permission by the person in charge.

 

Has anyone else tried this? Are there any CIC or SIC verdicts on this question?

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ganpat1956

Please refer to the earlier discussions in this thread.

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dkdinesh

A knowledgeable thread, I was not aware of these facts which were discussed in this thread. I hope that stay in the forum will give me a lots of new informations

 

reards

 

Dinesh Kalra

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ganpat1956

Dinesh, we have a lot of hidden gems in this portal. During your stay here, go through the various threads under RTI General Discussions one after the other. You are bound to learn a lot.

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chanda_s

photography may be possible in local offices, say collectorates or municipal corporations or banks or alike. but at the level of ministries like in south block and north block, even employees are not supposed to carry electronic equipment like mobiles or cameras. there is so much sensitive information lying around. with a camera, the layout of the office can be recorded, the place where records are kept can be recorded, where an important official sits can be traced and subsequently utilised by the enemies of the state. there could be even more sensitive information that can be leaked out. if one has ever been to ministries in north and south blocks and elsewhere one realises the importance of such info for our enemies.

 

are we willing to compromise our country's security and well being in the name of rti act? nothing is more important than the sovereignity and well being of the nation. interpretations of acts, modalities and procedures come next. if i were the pio or aa, i am sure i can convince the ic and the courts on this.

 

while definitely not as a norm, i believe photography need not be allowed in special cases.

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colnrkurup

Mr.Chanda,

You are absolutely correct. In such circumstances photography (Information) can be refused not because it is not permissible; but it fall under Section 8(a). Here the issue is "Is obtaining information in an elecronic mode" or seeking record using electronic camera" fall under the defenition of "Information". It does as established in above posts especialy that of Mr.Karira. It can be refused if fall under Section 8. The circumstances stated by you defenitely fall under 8(a), provided it is correct.

 

Even in the cicrcumstances mentioned by you, the request was not for the layout of the office. For that there is no need to allow the applicant to enter a place where public entrance is prohibited. The concerned file can be produced to him at the visitor's room where he can easily take its photograph. In that case it won't get the privilege of Section 8(a).

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karira
Is there camera allowed during the inspection:)

 

Manoj,

 

Please read the full thread above - there are 4 pages.

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colnrkurup

Shall we summarise ?

 

1. Right to information include obtaining information in any electronic mode. I am doubtful about ordinary camera; but obtaining through digital camera is obtaining information in electronic mode and naturally digital camera is permissible as per Section 2(f)(iv) RTI Act.

 

2. While seeking inspection of documents it is always advantageous to seek permission to use digital camera. If it is denied, it amount to denial of information.

 

3. Carry the digital camera while inspecting documents. Babus are generally too casual in maintaining files. While carrying out inspection one is bound to hit useful papers. In such cases click it with file number. In cases where we hit such documents the PIOs are generally taken-a-back when we seek its copy later. In such cases invariably they deny existance of such document when we seek its copy later. If we take the photograph of that documents with all evidence to prove its existence, the babus will find it impossible to conceal or deny it later.

 

I have been using digital camera always during inspection and had never felt any problem so far.

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i went to record room to inspect my land documents more than 50 years old kept in very bad condition using RTI POWER, i have asked record room incharge for permission to take photo graph of document i require but he denied allowing camera inside record room, can i get permission to take photograph of documents

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i went to record room to inspect my land documents more than 50 years old kept in very bad condition using RTI POWER, i have asked record room incharge for permission to take photo graph of document i require but he denied allowing camera inside record room, can i get permission to take photograph of documents

 

Your post/thread has been merged with an existing thread on the same topic.

Please read the full thread above and all the links given in the posts.

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Prashantvikey

I have noticed that the Web Links for the said CIC Decisions are dead as the page goes blank. Hence for the benefit of all the friends of our RTI Fraternity. I am attaching the said CIC decisions for your reference

 

 

CIC has shifted its data base of orders to another server with a new domain.

Therefore the old links given in the forum (in various posts) will not work.

In order to get the old decisions on the new website, please read the following post for a detailed tutorial:

 

http://www.rtiindia.org/forum/59421-how-seach-decision-cic-site.html

Decision_18092006_15 - Compiled.pdf

AD-23022009-06 - Compiled.pdf

Decision_31012007_17 - Compiled.pdf

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Ketan Modi

Dear all,

 

In one of the cases that I had represented and was co-applicant, the PIO's office (police organisation) had removed the court fee stamp that was affixed on the application towards fee and had asked my co-applicant to pay the fee again. The co-applicant wen to PIO's office and demanded inspection when it came to light that the stamp was forcibly removed leaving behind marks. We took photographs of the same and paid the fee for the second time under protest. Now the PIO and FAA, who too was party to this mischief are facing the music as we intend to seek compensation from these senior cops for metal stress suffered by us. I intend to take this matter to the High Court. I think we have a strong case as we have photographed the application in their possession. We had tried to lodge a complaint with the police for theft of property in government office's possession but cops being cops they will not listen to citizens and they think that indulging in corruption is their birth right. We are pursuing the case from that angle and are likely to succeed. Happy information seeking.

Ketan Modi

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Yes, You can allow videography, provided it is restricted to the information permissible

under the Act, unless it violates the parameters of any information sought and agreed to

be provided by you.

CIC held in one such case, held as follows:

“If an applicant wishes to make copies of records/ samples given to him for inspection at

his own expenses, it is not for the Public Authority to object to the form in which the

copies are being made, provided it is restricted to the information permissible under the

Act. There is no provision in the Act disallowing Videography, and therefore, cannot be

excluded unless it violates the parameters of any information sought and agreed to be

provided.”

[CIC/WB/A/2006/OO144 , 3 Aug,2006]

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sham dhanda

Hello,

क्या RTI ACT में ऐसा कोई प्रावधान है कि मैं किसी ऑफिस में रिकार्ड की जांच में के समय कैमरा ले जा सकता हूँ | अगर है तो उस धारा की जानकारी दे |

धन्यवाद

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karira

Yes, you can take a camera during inspection and take digital pictures of the records/documents.

 

Your post has been merged with another existing thread on the same toipic/subject.

Please read the full thread above (there are several pages !!)

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Prasad GLN

If you wanted to have hard copy for personal record on entire subject ..the summary of entire inspection with such earlier decisions on the subject...search in blogs for Inspection by Sri JP Shah and it quoted all earlier decisions and as to how to conduct inspections.

In the past , members carried that blog as hard copy showed it PIO, PIO has searched for the decisions and permitted later.

Irrespective of the final outcome in your particular case, always keep a hard copy of that blog when ever you visit for inspection.

 

(I have used this once, when records of 1958 was required. The register was in A 3 size. Mere opening the book, became risky as entire pages are brittle . Then with their permission, I have made that page in four photographs, got it photoshoppy and could get improved and better looking copies. Those were the days where there was severe shortage of white papers and brown papers were used for Govt. Correspondence/ Registers)

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